Genesis 6

[quote:17koc3b2]
1And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

2That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

3And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

5And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

6And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart. [/quote:17koc3b2]

Shall we discuss this most eccentric Biblical passage? I've never heard a sermon on verses 1-6. Who are/were the Nephilim and how/why did they impregnate our women? :lol:

In all seriousness, this is where I've found the dichotomy of human consciousness so interesting. I've often wondered why we 'naturally' ([i:17koc3b2]instinctively[/i:17koc3b2]) experience love and hate, etc. If we are indeed hybrids of the offspring of God's perfect creation (daughters of men) and the 'fallen ones' (sons of God, Nephilim), would it not explain our innate internal struggles between Good and Evil? Would it not also explain our tendencies toward rejection or denial of God (and why it is so difficult to submit to Him completely)? I mean, if our will was truly free - that is, independent of and from good and evil until we make a determination- who in his right mind would ever reject an all-loving, eternal, great God? No one right?

I believe these verses perhaps provide a biological explanation of good and evil yet I've never heard them discussed in common Judeo-Christian circles. Thoughts?

Comments

  • said:

    Who are/were the Nephilim and how/why did they impregnate our women?[/quote:2argpa5q]


    Giants with gigantic dongs? And why not?

    God, I can't even take this place seriously anymore.

  • said:

    said:

    Who are/were the Nephilim and how/why did they impregnate our women?[/quote:38e7fcnn]


    Giants with gigantic dongs? And why not?

    God, I can't even take this place seriously anymore.[/quote:38e7fcnn]

    C'mon, have a go at it. It's the word of God - not like I made it up or something. :lol:

    Another take on the verse from Wiki:
    [quote:38e7fcnn]"Now it came about, when men began to multiply on the face of the land, and daughters were born to them, that the sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves, whomever they chose. Then the Lord said, "My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; nevertheless his days shall be one hundred and twenty years." The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown.[5] [/quote:38e7fcnn]

    And a narrative from Wiki:
    [quote:38e7fcnn]The Targum Jonathan states that the Nephilim were given this name because they were descended from fallen angels.[7]

    The New American Bible commentary draws a parallel to the Epistle of Jude and the statements set forth in Genesis, suggesting that the Epistle refers implicitly to the paternity of Nephilim as heavenly beings who came to earth and had sexual intercourse with women.[8] The footnotes of the Jerusalem Bible suggest that the Biblical author intended the Nephilim to be an "anecdote of a superhuman race".[9] Genesis 6:4 implies that the Nephilim have inhabited the earth in at least two different time periods—in antediluvian times "and afterward." If the Nephilim were supernatural beings themselves, or at least the progeny of supernatural beings, it is possible that the "giants of Canaan" in Book of Numbers 13:33 were the direct descendants of the antediluvian Nephilim, or were fathered by the same supernatural parents.[/quote:38e7fcnn]

  • On another note, this could also explain the Greeks and others' fascination with polytheism and hybrid god-man beings. Perhaps Zeus, et al. weren't gods at all but nephilim....

    [quote:3bzefv3g]The story of the Nephilim is chronicled more fully in the Book of Enoch (part of Ethiopian biblical canon). Enoch, as well as Jubilees, connects the origin of the Nephilim with the fallen angels, and in particular with the Grigori (watchers). Samyaza, an angel of high rank, is described as leading a rebel sect of angels in a descent to earth to have sexual intercourse with human females:

    And it came to pass when the children of men had multiplied that in those days were born unto them beautiful and comely daughters. And the angels, the children of the heaven, saw and lusted after them, and said to one another: 'Come, let us choose us wives from among the children of men and beget us children.' And Semjaza, who was their leader, said unto them: 'I fear ye will not indeed agree to do this deed, and I alone shall have to pay the penalty of a great sin.' And they all answered him and said: 'Let us all swear an oath, and all bind ourselves by mutual imprecations not to abandon this plan but to do this thing.' Then sware they all together and bound themselves by mutual imprecations upon it. And they were in all two hundred; who descended in the days of Jared on the summit of Mount Hermon, and they called it Mount Hermon, because they had sworn and bound themselves by mutual imprecations upon it... [26][/quote:3bzefv3g]
  • Actually, this subject is handled in virtually every Bible commentary, and I've preached on it on more than one occasion. In a sense, there isn't too much preachable material here, other than the fact that it would appear, from the context of the text, that the enemy of God was perhaps making an attempt to pollute the genetic line of human kind so as to thwart God's plan for Messiah to be born of a particular person at a particular point in time.

    We may be able to draw inferences from this text to the remains of what are commonly thought of as precursors to homo sapiens, i.e., Neanderthal or other. Those remains may not, in fact, be part of the evolutionary ladder culminating with human beings, but rather, evidence of a peculiar passage of Scripture, made as if almost in passing on the way to a more important issue -- the sinful nature of mankind that God had desire to wipe from the face of the earth or the fact that too many of these "cross-breed" humans existed and needed to be removed by God using extraordinary means.

    The effort may have contiued post-flood, as there are further mention of "mighty men" and "giants" of incredible stature, Goliath, etc. We don't know that it isn't also still happening today, except we have no real evidence apart from sort of off-the-wall testimonies of weird goings on, alien abductions and the like.
  • That doesn't explain the giants though, Neanderthals were no larger than Sapiens; if anything they were on the shorter side.
  • Guy, thanks for chiming in with a pastor's take on it. I've always wanted to expand on this conversation with local ministers but frankly, I didn't want anyone to think I was nuts. Talking about hybrid man-beings does seem like paranormal paranoia to most. A good thing about the internet is open discussion without fear of retaliation (unless you count lolcats). :lol:
    said:

    Actually, this subject is handled in virtually every Bible commentary, and I've preached on it on more than one occasion. In a sense, there isn't too much preachable material here, other than the fact that it would appear, from the context of the text, that the enemy of God was perhaps making an attempt to pollute the genetic line of human kind so as to thwart God's plan for Messiah to be born of a particular person at a particular point in time.[/quote:3s9pv4uu]

    This certainly makes sense. However, when reading the KJV and the separate Enoch, one gets the impression that it was primarily lust on the part of the 'sons of God'. I suppose they could have had even worse intentions however. Perhaps Lucifer tempted them in order to complete his master plan?

    said:

    We may be able to draw inferences from this text to the remains of what are commonly thought of as precursors to homo sapiens, i.e., Neanderthal or other. Those remains may not, in fact, be part of the evolutionary ladder culminating with human beings, but rather, evidence of a peculiar passage of Scripture, made as if almost in passing on the way to a more important issue -- the sinful nature of mankind that God had desire to wipe from the face of the earth or the fact that too many of these "cross-breed" humans existed and needed to be removed by God using extraordinary means.[/quote:3s9pv4uu]

    I like how you think. Have you ever read the Book of Enoch? It is fascinating. It answers a ton of these type questions. Perhaps the church decided to leave it out due to its complicated mystical nature - and its almost incomprehensible insinuations (and implications). It's probably the only book that an argument can be made for canonical inclusion.


    said:

    The effort may have contiued post-flood, as there are further mention of "mighty men" and "giants" of incredible stature, Goliath, etc. We don't know that it isn't also still happening today, except we have no real evidence apart from sort of off-the-wall testimonies of weird goings on, alien abductions and the like.[/quote:3s9pv4uu]

    These 'off the wall' testimonies is why I don't talk to everyday people about this. Like I said, most people would try to lump me in the 'crazy' category. I assure you that for me it is simply curiousity - that is, trying to know and understand our origins. I am most interested in the bio-psychology - how and why we think as we do. Let me be clear - I am not challenging the Biblical story - only trying to make sense of it. What are your thoughts as to my hypothesis that we all could perhaps have 'hybrid' DNA? This certainly would explain our dichotomous consciousness and our tendencies toward both good and evil.

  • said:

    I've never heard a sermon on verses 1-6.[/quote:16rzzlk7]
    You haven't visited my church. The pastor did a 7-month series on the book of Genesis last year. He covered Genesis 6. But I had already studied this chapter on my own prior to this.

    said:

    if our will was truly free...who in his right mind would ever reject an all-loving, eternal, great God? No one right?[/quote:16rzzlk7]
    First of all, I find it humorous that you think free will should yield a homogenous decision. I agree, but some critics say that homogenous choices indicate no free will. Second of all, what if I wanted to be like God? There isn't enough room in the universe for two Gods, someone's gotta go. Isn't this a likely reason to reject an "all-loving, eteral, great God"?

    I'm short on time, I'd like to add more later. In the meantime, are you sure that the Nephilium were giants? There are a few places in the Old Testament where "men of valor" are spoken of in similar terms. The Nephilium could merely be men of valor, exceedingly good in warfare, like knights...or ninjas. Today we still speak of rock stars and heros as being "larger than life."

    I like the direction this thread is going. I'll be back later.

  • said:

    First of all, I find it humorous that you think free will should yield a homogenous decision. I agree, but some critics say that homogenous choices indicate no free will. [/quote:atckd6dn]

    I can certainly see how it could be a humorous suggestion. Although to be clear, I'm not debating the components - or requirements - of free will, but the origins of it. I'm conceding that free will exists - and with the requirements you state - but [i:atckd6dn]why[/i:atckd6dn] and [i:atckd6dn]how[/i:atckd6dn] do we have it? I hope I'm making sense...

    said:

    Second of all, what if I wanted to be like God? There isn't enough room in the universe for two Gods, someone's gotta go. Isn't this a likely reason to reject an "all-loving, eteral, great God"?[/quote:atckd6dn]

    This is my point indeed! You've just described the Fall - in a nutshell. I suggest that the daughters of men were pure and uncorrupted. The fallen ones (including their master Lucifer), due to their own [i:atckd6dn]vanity[/i:atckd6dn] (and [i:atckd6dn]lust[/i:atckd6dn] to a lesser extent) mated with them (creating hybrid DNA; i.e. giving us the dichotomy of consciousness). Their offspring became what would be considered modern humans. The biology makes sense - it would allow for traits of both good and evil - giving us independent choices as well as the reasoning skills to make said choices (or no choice at all). This could perhaps explain why we think the way we do.

    Essentially, what you are saying is exactly what part of 'us' is - VAIN. We inherently have (irrational) urges to want to be like God. We have this urge to reject - even though we know we shouldn't. Why?

  • said:

    The only other option I can think of is to believe that they are innate desires, but I left this out because in a world in which God is the creator, he is responsible for any innate features of human beings - therefore to say that the desires which comprise our will are innate is to say that they were caused [by God], which is contradictory to the premise that they are not caused. [/quote:1dpy7rns]

    Let's not assume God alone is responsible for the innate psychological features of human beings. Others may, but I do not. I propose that it is an inherent bio-psychological trait given to us by the fusion of our DNA by breeding nephilim (fallen angels) with God's pure blood line. My belief is supported - though certainly not validated - by a literal interpretation of Genesis 6 and the Book of Enoch.

    said:

    The last statement relates back to the same point as above: if we have any INHERENTLY irrational quality, then that is a result of our design, is it not? What I am proposing is a hypothetical world in which that inherent irrationality does not exist (which is logically possible).[/quote:1dpy7rns]

    Evil is not necessarily irrational (if this is what you're implying). If it was, it would be much easier to defeat.

    Edit - In order for my hypothesis and reasoning to hold, I have to concede that God exists and within the framework of the Bible narrative. I'm hypothesizing not on whether God exists, but instead how the (assumed) existence of both God and Lucifer, the fallen ones (nephilim), and "pure humans" could have resulted in interbreeding (via Genesis 6). This perhaps culminated into what today is the biology and psychology of modern humans.

  • Where do the lIzard people fit in? Art bell and George weren't exactly clear on the matter.
  • said:

    Where do the lIzard people fit in? Art bell and George weren't exactly clear on the matter.[/quote:3q9x8b25]

    While funny, it is important to realize that Art Bell and George Noory have nothing to do with the authentic Biblical language presented in this thread. Poking fun of Genesis 6 does not make it disappear.

    Humans fuse DNA all the time, creating hybrid by-products. Virtually everything we eat is genetically manipulated. Is it really a stretch to assume that if God and Lucifer exist and are these supernatural mega-humans as the Bible suggests, that they too can manipulate DNA?

  • God and Lucifer can do whatever they want. Genesis is vague on this topic, and ultimately it is unanswerable.
Sign In or Register to comment.